BABY POMATIA.

[anjieburdett]

Look at this - one of Arno's babies! OMG They are soo cute.

[Leah]

awwwww!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Deleted]

how long till they become adults?

[anjieburdett]

Haven't got a clue Mike, you'll have to ask The Brosi when he gets back.

Anjie,x.

[Paul]

I have some Helix pomatia, they are slower growing than aspersa/aspersum. I've had mine 6 months probably, and they have grown from 1cm to 3-3.5 cm in that time. So, they're approaching the maximum size. Perhaps, given good conditions and loads of food they can approach apsersa in growth rate, they are quite active. And they burrow rather than hang like aspersa. I'm hoping for eggs this year, I'm sure my biggest two must be sexually mature now or nearly there.

[anjieburdett]

Oh WOW Paul. Have you got some too?? Cool. Where did you get yours? If you don't mind me asking. Are these the snails that are rare in this country? Did they used to be common here then? What happened to reduce their numbers?

Questions Questions. I should go to Google shouldn't I .. lol.

Anjie,x.

[natrat84]

Awwwwwww so cute ;D

[Paul]

I got mine from Birte ages ago.

They are the rare type over here. Populations still exist in this country but they are about to be classifieds as protected because these isolated populations have no hope of joining up. There are absolutely none in the north of England. They were decimated by collection for eating by resteraunts all over the south. As they are slower growing and slower to reproduce they've never really recovered. They've been here for about 2000 years and although introduced by the Romans (like apersa) they are considered native coz they have integrated into our eco-system.

I've spoken to various organisations and there are no plans to reintroduce them, even though they are considered non-invasive.

[anjieburdett]

Thats a shame, they should try to re-introduce them. How easy is it to re-introduce a species. I mean - if i released some and kept releasing them....would that be a waste of time or would that work in time?

[Paul]

I had the same sentiments, and it was part of the reason I spoke to English Nature etc about supplying them with disease-free captive-bred babies if they had a reintroduction programme. But they weren't interested.

See below:

Hi,

The Environment Agency told me to contact you, so I hope you can help.

I keep snails and I was hoping to obtain some Helix pomatia. Because they are on the protected species list and I can't obtain them by collection, I wondered if there is a breeding and reintroduction programme for them that I could perhaps participate in? Can you get a licence to collect for breeding purposes?

I was also wondering if I managed to obtain some captive bred stock,perhaps from Germany (or maybe from a UK conservation project) whether Iam allowed to re-naturalise after breeding them in the UK and whether there are conservation groups who would gratefully receive them?

Regards
Paul King


Helix pomatia is currently not a protected species in the UK - there is a (neutral) consultation currently under way by DEFRA:

www.defra.gov.uk/corporate/consult/wildlifeact-review58/consultation.pdf

seeking views on whether it would be desirable to have the species covered by Schedule 5 of the 1981 Wildlife & Countryside Act. Therefore there is not currently a requirement for a license to collect this species from the wild. It is mainly threatened by (semi) commercial collection for restaurant escargots.

With respect to a captive breeding and release programme as you suggest, it is probably really not necessary. Should the protection be afforded, the species is likely to recover reasonably spontaneously where it still occurs - it is not uncommon in the right habitat away from areas of high public access in the South East of England, though may not recolonise areas if it has been exterminated (I don't actually know of this having happened, though it is by no means impossible).

I'd certainly caution against importing breeding stock for release from abroad. I'm fairly unclear what the legal situation would be on this (it is initially an introduced species and therefore possibly in a bit of a grey area with respect to the normal rules for importation and release under various bits of legislation). There could be small possibility of introduction of disease, and addition of continental stock could easily compromise any genetic studies that could be done to determine the true origins and subsequent evolution of the species in the UK. Besides, it is not necessary as it is currentlty legal to collect UK material should you wish to breed it in captivity.

I hope this helps
Dr Roger S Key
Senior Invertebrate Biologist
Terrestrial Wildlife Team
English Nature


and....

Hi Peter,

I was told to contact you when I spoke to the Rangers office at Pennington Flash. I'd like to discuss an idea regarding the snail Helix pomatia.

As you may know, this species is currently up for review to be put on the protected species list. Although it was introduced by the Romans 2000 years ago it is considered part of the UK's natural fauna.

It has been decimated by illegal collection for restaurants and any colonies that do exist are completely isolated with no hope for them to join. It is considered to be a non-invasive species.

The reason I am contacting you is that I keep various species of snail and I am looking to import some Helix pomatia from two different countries in Europe where they are more prevalent. Just to expand my hobby. I was wondering if there is a bio-diversity action plan that would allow you to re-naturalise offspring in various areas in the North West.

Although my snails will be from abroad, I am talking about any offspring. I have no plans to introduce them to the wild myself or breed them for that matter but after to speaking to a number of biologists, pest experts and malacologists I have been told that parasites don't pass from snail to egg. This may need to be researched more thoroughly, something for which I assume you will have many contacts to hand.

So, very soon I will be one of only a few people in the country with a breeding colony of captive-bred Helix pomatia, pest-free.

I was wondering if you would like me to provide you with offspring, free of course, which I could do if you would like. In captivity, we could expect a 90% hatching viability and with up to potential few hundred eggs per clutch per snail, I can rear enough for you to reintroduce into an area such as Pennington flash.

I thought I would write to ask, these snails seem sadly overlooked. Snails are great indicators of environmental health and many countryside birds used to eat them regularly.

I look forward to hearing your comments on the matter.

Regards
Paul King


Hi Paul,

I have made a few enquiries and I have been advised that this species only appears on LBAPS in some south eastern counties such as Bucks' and Herts'. From the literature I have to hand the distribution appears to be south of a line from the Wash to the Severn. Unless there are any historical records for north-west England it seems to be an unlikely candidate for introduction to this or any other site in the area as there could be environmental factors also affecting its range in the UK . I would suggest contacting English Nature or DEFRA as a starting point.

Hope this helps.
Regards
Peter Alker
[/i]

[anjieburdett]

They're just not interested then are they? Thats a shame - would it be irresponsible of me then to release any offspring that mine 'make' lol into the wild? Say, in my local woods or a Riverside park/conservation area?

Anjie,x.

[Arno]

Paul,I guess if you have a garden you can research a little releasing them in the wild program
yourself and see how they are doing after awhile.
I know that in The Netherlands people have released them decades ago,which is why we have some pockets of distribution there.

[Paul]

I only have a little back yard although there are hundreds and hundreds of snails. I was thinking of relocating some to make room for a little population of pomatia. The emails caution against this because of disease but when you consider that snails migrate from place to place on shipping containers I imagine that any damage they could do has been done. Also, in my experience of species reintroduction, like fish stocks, they move them from place to place after being caught, rather than breeding them so I was a little surprised at their answer, especially since I was suggesting they do it. But I suppose they advise caution by default.

I think the most important thing is that they are classified by DEFRA as a non-invasive species.

It'd certainly be nice to have another species around, up here we mainly have aspersa, any other species are quite tricky to find even when you get out of urban sprawl.