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Post by Paul on Feb 18, 2006 19:10:39 GMT
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Val
Archachatina dimidiata
Posts: 2,498
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Post by Val on Feb 18, 2006 19:19:36 GMT
Looks really smashing Paul, the bottom pic though shouldn't they be var.dimidiata?
Val
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Post by Paul on Feb 18, 2006 19:24:34 GMT
Looks really smashing Paul, the bottom pic though shouldn't they be var.dimidiata? Val Yep, you're right
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Post by section8angel on Feb 18, 2006 21:14:48 GMT
I thought we weren't calling them dimidiata anymore? Or am I missing something? lol I'm just gonna give up and call them all snail 1, 2 etc >=/ lol
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Arno
Archachatina puylaerti
Posts: 1,493
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Post by Arno on Feb 18, 2006 21:24:53 GMT
No you're right,dimidiata is now obsolete.
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Post by section8angel on Feb 18, 2006 21:25:48 GMT
Except for the "real" dimis? That's still right isn't it?
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Post by Paul on Feb 18, 2006 21:26:13 GMT
When I said "You're right" I meant Val was right about me mislabelling the pic and that they were that form, we now call "two-tone" lol
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Post by section8angel on Feb 18, 2006 21:28:25 GMT
Ahhh lol I'm still sticking to snail 1, 2 etc ROFL. P.S Page looks great ;D
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Post by Paul on Feb 18, 2006 21:41:49 GMT
Except for the "real" dimis? That's still right isn't it? That's correct, there is still the South African Archachatina dimidiata.
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KathyM
Achatina tincta
Posts: 709
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Post by KathyM on Feb 18, 2006 22:11:10 GMT
Bloody hell confuse us more why not! ;D I think it must be fashionable to change species names repeatedly *rofl!*
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Post by section8angel on Feb 18, 2006 22:32:55 GMT
Lol. Good good.
I don't need to change anymore do I? Please say no lol. I've changed panthera and dimis, I think that's all we've said about lol.
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KathyM
Achatina tincta
Posts: 709
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Post by KathyM on Feb 18, 2006 23:31:00 GMT
Right well that's it, I'm claiming achatina immaculata var. anorexica as the "proper" name for Justin.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Feb 20, 2006 14:26:45 GMT
i'm assuming 'small form' means stuhlmanni
why isnt there a picture of panthera striped form? or is that overlapping normal immaculata?
oh btw its very good ;D
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Post by Paul on Feb 20, 2006 15:15:03 GMT
They overlap heavily and the striped one's I have seen pics of looked very ventricose. If we are still gonna split them into groups a striped panthera would have to be slim.
The small form means what we called "stuhlmanni". I didn't want to use names of snails that actually exist.
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LisaLQ
Archachatina papyracea
Old friend (emphasis on the "old")
Posts: 2,995
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Post by LisaLQ on Feb 20, 2006 15:58:09 GMT
I didn't know about the stuhlmanni being immaculata, I thought they were completely different considering their odd shell shape. I think we may as well bang all GALS in the immac group, would make it much easier!
I was just wondering, is this just your theory Paul - or is there any authority behind this? Name changes that is - is it agreed on by top snail expert type folks?
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Feb 20, 2006 17:18:57 GMT
I think we may as well bang all GALS in the immac group, would make it much easier! hehe lol ;D
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Leah
Archachatina puylaerti
Do you want me to sit in the corner and rust, or just fall apart where I'm standing?
Posts: 1,261
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Post by Leah on Feb 20, 2006 17:22:35 GMT
So there are still dimis? O crap. My brain can't handle this. So whats the difference between Archachatina dimidiata and Achatina immaculata ver. two tone?
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Kevin
Archachatina dimidiata
Posts: 2,227
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Post by Kevin on Feb 20, 2006 17:33:25 GMT
So there are still dimis? O crap. My brain can't handle this. So whats the difference between Archachatina dimidiata and Achatina immaculata ver. two tone? There are Archachatina dimidiata, but there isnt such species as Achatina dimidiata, all snails sold as Achatina dimidiata are Achatina immaculata var. two tone. As far as I know no-one keeps Archachatina dimidiata, they would have a blunt apex and a raised "V" on they're tail like all other Archachatina sp. I would think.
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Post by Paul on Feb 20, 2006 17:33:40 GMT
Well, one is an Archachatina that grows to about 8cm and the other is an Achatina that grows to 15cm. If you remember, it turned out to be this Archachatina that caused the immaculata to be mislabled as dimidiata, because they have similar shells.
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Leah
Archachatina puylaerti
Do you want me to sit in the corner and rust, or just fall apart where I'm standing?
Posts: 1,261
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Post by Leah on Feb 20, 2006 17:41:29 GMT
Ok got it. So the only similarities really are the shells (and the obvious fact that they are snails, lol). So in that case its quite shocking that they are still confused because the differences are quite clear when you put it that way.
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Post by Paul on Feb 20, 2006 17:41:59 GMT
I didn't know about the stuhlmanni being immaculata, I thought they were completely different considering their odd shell shape. I think we may as well bang all GALS in the immac group, would make it much easier! They are definitely not stuhlmanni. They don't have granulated nepionic whorls, I've had a look. Also, they have a pink columella, panthera shape and somehow managed to successfully crossbreed with immaculata; the only case I've heard of for definite. And Nisbet reported small slender offspring from some large wild-caught ones, that fit the profile exactly. So, if they are stuhlmanni I am the queen of sheba! They could also be derived from the dwarf var. lamarckiana. It depends on what you mean, stuhlmanni being Achatina and having granulated whorls whereas immaculata having smooth is the opinion of Malacologists and the examples I have studied from my snails has backed this up so far. Panthera really being immaculata is also the opinion of Malacologists. The only thing I have done is try to group them under names that are meaningful to us, like the site says, they are at best whimsical without locale info. And the normalisation of subspecies hasn't been done yet. I can't even find any listed immaculata variants. So I have took the variants officially listed for both species and added only 2. The var. "two-tone" and the var. "panthera" both of which could easily be listed under var. immaculata. I just did it to help explain the situation. At this stage a lumper would probably stick to 3 variants. Dwarf, Albino and the rest going under var. immaculata.
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Post by Paul on Feb 20, 2006 17:48:50 GMT
Ok got it. So the only similarities really are the shells (and the obvious fact that they are snails, lol). So in that case its quite shocking that they are still confused because the differences are quite clear when you put it that way. Well it seems that way, but it's no wonder, trying to find accurate info is a nightmare, we only just got pictures of Archachatina dimidiata and the BNHM indicated it was A.dimidiata which could have confused someone if they didn't realise it was an Archachatina. Added to the fact that there was an Achatina dimidiata which got reclassed as Achatina balteata var. infrafusca. And the 2 types come from roughly the same location. If you look through the historical synonyms and books you will see that people mistook Archachatina for Achatina all the time.
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LisaLQ
Archachatina papyracea
Old friend (emphasis on the "old")
Posts: 2,995
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Post by LisaLQ on Feb 20, 2006 18:58:02 GMT
They are definitely not stuhlmanni. They don't have granulated nepionic whorls, I've had a look. Also, they have a pink columella, panthera shape and somehow managed to successfully crossbreed with immaculata; the only case I've heard of for definite. And Nisbet reported small slender offspring from some large wild-caught ones, that fit the profile exactly. So, if they are stuhlmanni I am the queen of sheba! They could also be derived from the dwarf var. lamarckiana. I'm confused. Whose snails aren't stuhlmanni? I was talking about stuhlmanni in general, they are listed on PetSnails main site, and on Achatinidae (sp?), and are nothing like immacs. That was what I was talking about. I wasn't for one minute suggesting my dimis were stuhlmanni so dont know whose snails you're on about!
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Feb 20, 2006 19:04:59 GMT
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LisaLQ
Archachatina papyracea
Old friend (emphasis on the "old")
Posts: 2,995
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Post by LisaLQ on Feb 20, 2006 19:14:03 GMT
So do other immacs have the shell that comes further over them?
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