Shell Has Suddenly Degraded

[dolf]

Guys,

If you have any tips for Gary and me, they would be greatly appreciated. As you can see his shell has degraded and the color has disappeared from part of it. It seemed to happen rather quickly. Or perhaps I just didn’t notice it.

As you can see in the pic, I have cuttle bones in the tank. In fact I just added some extra. He has always had this source of calcium.

The shell seems a little brittle and rough to the touch, but seems relatively solid. Should I try “painting” him with nail polish??

Let me know if there’s anything I can do and how serious you think this is.

Thanks!
Dolf

P.S. He is moving around and eating and otherwise seems ok.

Attachments:

[lucyjames]

This has happened to a few of my lads - check here for others ideas:

petsnails.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=growth&action=display&thread=7777

I found that it righted itself in Bernie's case, in two other cases though the snails have just stopped growing altogether at the moment.

[malti]

In that thread there is sunlight mentioned...

now combining human health with animal...sunlight gives us Vitamin D which helps absorb calcium, so I suspect its Vit D deficiency

"Sufficient levels of vitamin D are crucial for calcium absorption in your intestines. Without sufficient vitamin D, your body cannot absorb calcium, "

www.naturalnews.com/003069.html

Dolf do your snails have natural sunlight access...or can u provide UV lights for short periods?

[Rachel]

I'd suggest adding another calcium source (mabye daily liquid calcium baths?), and as malti said there is a theory that snails need vitamin d to absorb calcium, so you could try spending half an hour to an hour sat somewhere in the sun with him on your hand (mist him regularly to keep him cool and wet though).

[siobhanc54]

I put liquid calcium with vitamin d in the mister bottle, I have recently bought a tiger with similar shell growth and can see the difference in just 2 weeks

[dolf]

Guys, thanks for all of the great suggestions.

The guys do not get direct sunlight but they are on the first floor of the house in the kitchen area with many windows and indirect light. I'll make a point to make sure they get some direct sun for a few minutes from time to time.

So putting diluted calcium/vitamin D in the mister bottle seems like a good idea to me. I'll also look for some foods with more VItamin D.

[malti]

Sept 7, 2009 12:57:00 GMT dolf said:

Guys, thanks for all of the great suggestions.

The guys do not get direct sunlight but they are on the first floor of the house in the kitchen area with many windows and indirect light. I'll make a point to make sure they get some direct sun for a few minutes from time to time.

So putting diluted calcium/vitamin D in the mister bottle seems like a good idea to me. I'll also look for some foods with more VItamin D.

remember that essential uv doesn't pass through glass, and happy to be of help - keep us updated ;D

[dave1961]

i have added wet oyster & limestone powder in a bowl as well as there cuttle bone i have noticed they like to go between the different sources. and the shells are better than using one source, also i add powdered hemp seed dry, they seem to prefer it off the substrate not in a bowl.

[dolf]

Regarding the use of liquid calcium... Do I need to worry about diluting it? If I have a typical sized mister bottle how much should I use??

I just want to make sure I don't hurt the guys...

Would it hurt them if they ingested it at full strength??? Just curious.

[Dusk]

A couple of drops per mister bottle will be about right There's also the option of keeping limestone chips and/or oyster shell grit in the bottom of your spray bottle.

[coyote]

I think it depends on the capacity of your spray bottle, which come in many different sizes. I've seen recommendations for as low as 2 to 3 drops per bottle (unspecified size) and as high as 4 to 8 drops per liter bottle of water. I'm using the latter guideline for my liquid calcium usage.

[dolf]

Thanks Coyote! I will use the 4 to 8 drops per liter bottle as a guideline.

[dolf]

Final inquiry on this matter! I promise...

Just returned from the store with Liquid Coral Calcium w/ Vitamin D. It states from Okinawa Japan on the bottle. It is 1000mg Coral Calcium.

Would the 4 to 8 drops per 1 Liter of Water be ok for this strength???

Also, is the benefit from the snails actually drinking this in??? Or merely from it being misted over their shells???

Thanks for all of your help.

[coyote]

I'm not sure of any benefit from misting the shell, but I suspect the mist on the skin would be absorbed, at least somewhat. I know snails can absorb calcium through the foot, and I'll bet the rest of the skin has varying degrees of absorbing capabilities as well. Of course, ingesting it will benefit them too!

If it was me, I would go ahead and use 4 to 8 drops per liter.

[stienbabe]

It's really difficult to overdose your snails on calcium. Scientific studies have shown that optimal shell growth occurs with 20% of the diet being calcium and that adverse affects are not shown until over 25%!

[Rachel]

I'd go with four to eight drops, it sounds about right to me. Just remember not to put it undiluted onto the snail, it causes them to swell up in reaction to it.

[dolf]

Thanks to every to everyone for the suggestions. The boys got their first spraying today. I guess I will just make the liquid calcium a permanent part of their diet from now on since I can't count on them eating the cuddle bone. I tossed in some egg shell/white for good measure last night and actually saw one of them eating at it.

Hopefully I will have a good "after" picture in a few weeks to post...

I put 6 drops in my 700 ml spray bottle... That should hopefully be potent enough...

[coyote]

Let us know how it goes!

[dolf]

I was hoping for a full recovery (the shell completely returns to normal) but that hasn't happened. I have picked him up a few times and gently touched the affected area. It seems relatively hard. But I didn't want to crush him so I didn't press too hard.

The area looks a little better. There seems to be a little more color. I'll keep up with the liquid calcium and hopefully see some more improvement.

Was also curious/worried as to whether spraying water (with calcium) negatively affects the taste of their food and water?

[Katie]

I doubt it affects their taste negatively. Its part of thier natural diet, and Snails are often found eating cuttlebone, which is calcium (not quite the same as liquid, but for the example) and so they can't dislike it? It doesn't seem to bother my Snails, but then the liquid C doesn't really seem to help them at all anyways. Both their shells have gone quite dodgy, my Jade in particular.

Has anyone found out if the UV light thingy helps?

[aerliss]

I put 15 drops of 170,000ppm in my 750ml mister bottle with every other refill. So far I've not witnessed any negative effects and they still happily rasp at the cuttle bone (even though Avery is pretty much at the limit of his growth at three years old).

I don't think it should affect the taste of the food... at least my snails still eat.

The area of bad shell growth will never be perfect as the shell, for the most part, is technically dead, like our finger nails, so can't heal itself except on the inside.

You could try giving the shell a coating of oil to help protect it? I've seen sesame seed oil suggested mostly, but I use flax seed oil. It's stopped the colour loss on my fulica... though the retics like to eat it and WILL try to nom on the the cloth I use and 'lick' it off their shells *sigh*

[coyote]

When I spray my tank with a liquid calcium solution, I often see snails crawling up the glass to drink the droplets, so I doubt the calcium imparts a bad taste, especially at such low concentrations.

[dolf]

Thanks guys! Next step might be a UV lamp for the guys. I am afraid to leave them in direct sunlight for too long! That whole sun-through-the-magnifying-glass thing...

[Katie]

Does the flax seed oil work then? In keeping the Snails shell colourful? I may well have to try that . . .

[hector2008]

It looks as though you have this problem well in hand but I thought I would throw this into the mix as well . My fulica would not eat their cuttlefish also so I got my pestle and mortar out and crushed it, the cuttlefish not the snails. The results now being that the growth on them is very fast and I put in about two cuttlefish ground down in a plastic container a week. You could try this but I would also say that you keep up what your doing as it seems to be working. If the area is very large the chances are that not all of the shell will grow back but your snail will be OK. Good luck and guys well done I did not know some of this stuff was available. I would be careful about the light as this may dry out there skins and tank, I trust this is not a basking light that also creates UV as a reptile keeper I Know how strong they get and how hot everything becomes around it. A UV tube maybe OK but I would still get worried the snails would hurt their selfs if they climbed or touched the shells upon it. The idea that the snail needs UV light is a good one but not all snails come out in the day so how much this is relevant I do not know. I would consult a specialist in this field before I committed to this as it maybe a waste of money.