Help needed setting up new tanks! :)

[Evil Angel]

After constantly battling with my tanks to get them the right temps/PH, they've ended up completely covered in bubblewrap, looking a right state and they still aren't even giving the right stats!

And so I've decided to ditch them completely and start again!

I'm starting with my 'baby tank', and as it only needs to be small I have ordered a 24L plastic storage tub.

To help keep heat and humidity up, I'm only going to be drilling a small amount of holes in it.

But I'm not sure what I should do in the way of actually heating it.

I'm absolutely RUBBISH at attaching heat mats to the side, they are never flush with the side and I can never attach the foil/ploystyrene so it fits nice and snug to it, and as a result the mats dont even keep themselves warm never mind creating the temps I want!

So should I try under tank heating maybe?

The size tubs I ordered are 43(L) x 32(W) x 24(H) cm, and therefore I think the size heat mats I should be looking at for under-heating would be roughly 20x20 cm, but the only heat mats that come in this size are the exo terra ones, and although they sound really good, reviews from other people have said that not only do they not heat up at all, they can also go funny and start melting and burning down the house, so am reluctant to use them.

But I cannot find any other mats that would fit under!

Would a 4"x5" habistat do the job? I'm worried it might be too small, but then the next size up 6"x11" would be too big...
I'm sick of heat mats never heating enough, but don't want to risk cooking my snails either, so really need some help!

I want 25'C-30'C temps and 80-90% humidity, how can I heat my tanks enough to achieve this?

Please help!
Thanks!

[aimee]

I've just ordered this
www.ebay.co.uk/itm/400219197363?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2649

You've seen pics of my large enclousures, the tigers currently have a 17x11in 20w mat covered by camping mat, and goes from 19-22c which is not enough. They never burrow so I'm going to lay an inch of substrate, put in the 'under floor heating' then lay the rest of the substrate on top. Put a hole in the lid, take plug apart, poke wire though, put plug back together.

I am hopeful this will bring the temp up.

I will update with progress once it gets here!

[starcrazy19]

I'd be really interested in this also - I have trouble getting my tanks above 20-21, room temp basically. Most of the mats I've looked at say suitable for glass tanks only - but since loads of people use plastic tubs to house snails, I assume they must be able to use heat mats on them?

I have an exo-terra mat on the side of one tank, probably the very one you've mentioned - it is self-sticking (sticky back) which helps but the thing is barely warm to the touch and I'm not sure it's making any difference at all.

The other tank has one that gets much warmer but it STILL won't budge the temperature more than 1 or 2 degrees. Do you just need loads of mats all around one end of the tank or something to get it up to say 25? Glad I'm not the only one who can't figure this out!

[aimee]

You can get shorter and lower wattage cables, maybe to protect snails who like to burrow you could layer things like this

-substrate
-weed control fabric
-gravel/stones or similar
-heating cables
-gravel/stones

[aimee]

Or how about a splash sproof mat? They can go inside, maybe it would warm better.
www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Reptile-Vivarium-Propagator-Heat-Mat-Moisture-Proof-20W-/400298141807?pt=UK_Pet_Supplies_Reptiles_Spiders_Insects&hash=item5d33a0e86f
That would go under about half the tank i think. Stones on top then fabric then substrate?

[Evil Angel]

One of my tanks is 'perfect', it is a 110l tub, and has 2 huge heat mats which cover both the long sides of the tank + foil and polystyrene (it's a real eye-sore!), and although I'm getting really good readings, I don't like the fact it doesn't have a cool side, so don't want to and can't afford to do it to all of my tanks, so was hoping to find a better way of getting the stats I need!

As I said, I find it almost impossible to attach mats to the side well enough for heat to be forced into the tank, the heat is just lost completely no matter how hard I try!

So I think the only way I'm going to get it right is with a correctly sized heat mat for under the tank. But I did try it before and used a mat that was over half and one of my snails sadly got cooked, so as you can imagine I am nervous about trying it again and want to make sure I get the right size/wattage mat!

I'm just finding it so hard finding the right balance between cooking the snails and heat mat doing nothing! I've been trying to get it right for 3 years now and I'm so close to just packing it all in because I just can't get it right!!

[Evil Angel]

That splash mat does seem good and am really tempted to try it!

[pinkunicorn]

Our house is about 22C so I think my tiger+fuli tank is about 2-4 degrees warmer just from the lamp alone. I'm a bit unsure if it's warm enough for the tigers though. They seem sleepy and I only ever see the fulis as the tigers dig deep after I dig them up for dinner every few days. It's also quite humid, judging by skin feel. My hand gets a little moist when I put it in the tank. I spray once a a day and keep a water bowl (a plastic bird bath, perfect size).

I guess I should get a temp/humidity meter...

Oh and the tank is an aquarium with a lid with a lamp. The lamp is in a plastic case so it doesn't burn the snails even if they go sleep near it. It seems to create quite good conditions on its own.

[Evil Angel]

My partner loves the cold, so even though it's winter he has the windows open and the fan going, and our house never gets warm even in summer, so I always have a lot of trouble getting my tanks the right temps!

I found a smaller size of that mat 15x15cm, which would be a better size for my 24L tub, not sure whether to just put it under the tank or whether to try placing it inside..

[Evil Angel]

I really would like to try that mat inside my new tub, but as I'm going to have to do it to all my tanks eventually I need to keep it cheap.. So, would just a folded piece of capillary matting on top of it be enough to stop it cooking my snails?

[morningcoffee]

Nov 10, 2012 17:45:04 GMT starcrazy19 said:

I'd be really interested in this also - I have trouble getting my tanks above 20-21, room temp basically. Most of the mats I've looked at say suitable for glass tanks only - but since loads of people use plastic tubs to house snails, I assume they must be able to use heat mats on them?

I have an exo-terra mat on the side of one tank, probably the very one you've mentioned - it is self-sticking (sticky back) which helps but the thing is barely warm to the touch and I'm not sure it's making any difference at all.

The other tank has one that gets much warmer but it STILL won't budge the temperature more than 1 or 2 degrees. Do you just need loads of mats all around one end of the tank or something to get it up to say 25? Glad I'm not the only one who can't figure this out!

Do you have it stuck on plastic or glass? It's very hard for the heat to pass through plastic as it naturally insulates and doesn't get very warm. It may help to drill some holes on the wall where the heatmat is if it's a plastic tank.

Also, do you have the back of the heatmat insulated? Try covering the back with some bubble wrap, polystyrene or radiator insulation. That will help prevent the heat from escaping the wrong way.

You should not EVER put a heatmat under any tank, even a plastic one, as it can heat up the substrate to an uncomfortable level for the snails and can injure or even kill them when they burrow. Heatmats should only ever go on the side of tanks for snails. They need warm air in the tank, not hot substrate.

The best way to ensure the tank gets heated properly is to get a glass tank for the snails, but unfortunately this can be expensive and may not be an option for everyone. There's no easy way to get plastic tanks heated up well, although it may help to put the tank near a radiator or heater - not pressed up against it or on top of it, as this could make the entire tank too warm and not give the snails anywhere to escape to a cooler spot.

[shaydeesnail]

When I can afford it. I think I'm going to give the heat cables a try.
The problem with heat mats seems to be that under the tank isn't always safe, yet putting them on the side of the tanks just doesn't seem to work for a lot of people.
To be honest, I didn't even know about any other options except heat mats and lamps before, so this thread has been useful for me!

[aimee]

I'll be taking temperature readings from the middle of the substrate and the air to see what happens. I can appreciate that snails need warm air but I think warm air and warm ground is better than freezing their snail willies off.
It will need a very close eye kept on it in the initial stages, but for deep substrate and snails that don't borrow this may be the best option for us

[latebloomer]

I have found that the two main problems are keeping the mat firmly pressed on in the first place and stopping the heat escaping on the other. I have something between the insulated mat and the wall to keep the mat in firm contact all the way on the tank. Any humid air escaping between the drill holes and the mat could loosen the sticky tape holding the mat on. Once the whole mat fell off insulation and all lol. The bigger the tank the harder it is get the conditions you want. I have even placed my tiger tank on top of 2 thick books either side to put a covered hot water bottle underneath, not touching, to warm the air underneath morning and evening, Sometimes wish I had stuck to fulis.

[tsrebel]

You could place the heat mat under the snailarium, but you would need a really thick layer of substrate to prevent the snails from getting burned/cooked. The 24cm height of your new tank seems too short for doing this.
I've wondered about using a heat bulb for aquariums somehow, as I have some around that's not in use. They have a built in thermostate, but may be destroyd if not in contact with water. How about placing the heat bulb in a bottle of water (covered, so no snails can drown in it) and placing it inside the snailarium?

[pinkunicorn]

What about "trapping" the mat between two tanks? It means you can't generally move the tanks about but also the heat should not escape as much as it's shared between the tanks. You could have, say, four tanks in a square and put a few mats where the tanks connect.

[Evil Angel]

I do think a mat would work well if pressed into two tanks, but I personally can't sandwich my matts due to the fact my tanks have to all be stacked on top of each other as have no space in my flat.
And I've found that with storage tubs they are either slanted or have lids that stick over and would prevent the sides of the tanks touching anyway..

I'm thinking of putting the waterproof mat on the side of my tank, it's seems to be a good size with a decent wattage, that I hope might warm up better than the normal mats!

But if that doesn't work, I think I'll try puting it inside, with lots of folded capillary matting to subdue the heat, then my substrate on top.. It's not going to be housing anything until it's perfect, so no harm im trying it!

If both of those methods fail, I'll try the cables in the same way, as they're lower wattage might work better underneath..

Like I say, it's only a test tank really that will house my babies if I manage to get it right, but in the meantime I'm only using it to play around with, so will give plenty of different things a go!

I just really want to find a cheap and effective way of heating this tank so I get ideas of how I can improve all my larger tanks too!

[muddydragon]

Glass tanks really are better and can often be found cheap on ebay (especially if they have the odd crack or something you can just fill in with a bit of sealant). but obviously if you want to stack then glass tanks are a problem. I've successfully heated plastic tanks in the past by sellotaping a heat mat to the side of the tank (to get it pressed up close) and then cutting a bit of expanded polystyrene or foam to size/shape and getting it well wedged on (maybe more sellotape/duct-tape) a silvery layer between the mat and the polystyrene helps too.

Since hot air rises you can cut some polystyrene to the size of the lid and this will help insulate also. (i successfully heated my tanks like this during the really cold winter when we lost all our heating - i didn't loose a single snail). if you have a hard (non carpeted floor) try putting some insulation on the floor under the stack aswell to stop any conductive loss of heat there.

you could also try a more powerful mat and get a matstat to stop the tank overheating.

You can also try prioritising so those that need the warmer tanks (like margies) are in glass tanks and those that don't need it as warm (such as fulica) in plastic tanks.

The location int he stack will also affect the level of warmth. depending on how many are in a stack try and get the ones needing warmer temperatures in the middle/towards the top and those that need cooler temps towards the extremities. Also keeping all the mats aligned in the stack (ie on the same side) can help.

If you have lots of similar sizes tanks with similar conditions heat mats etc, you can use one mat stat in one tank to control several tanks - it's no where near as effective and needs a bit of fiddling but can help.

hope some of this may help

[Evil Angel]

The trouble is I'm already doing everything you just listed, as most of my collection are margies and tigers I have to prioritise all but but one tank.

I've already sellotaped the mats, used foil and polystyrene, used bubblewrap on the lids, with thick polystyrene under my stack of tanks too, and I've moved them to the warmest part of the house, and the mats are aligned.

I cant afford to have glass tanks, as would cost me easily £200+ even buying the cheapest ones. I have no where to keep so many large tanks so would mean losing a mass of my collection. And I find glass tanks to always be very unsightly unless a fortune is spent doing them up, and would be a much bigger eyesore than what I have already and I think my partner would simply refuse to have them in the house as he hates snails and mud, and with glass tanks he would see many snails, much mud and probably my tiger worms too, and he would go mad at me lol!

I've bought the tub, plus my own drill, stocked up on foil, polystrene, capillary matting, and bought it a hygro-temp guage, but run out of funds for the actual mat lol. But hoping it will work! The reason I think this may be my only option, is because plastic doesn't conduct heat very well, if I'm using a mat on the outside I wont be able to get heat it through it, but if I use the mat on the inside, the heat wont be able to escape either.. so I'm going to experiment with how much matting to use to keep the substrate safe, and warmer substrate will result in higher humidity, and I'll play around with the amount of air vents the tank needs and see if I can find a way of safely and effectively heating a storage box, and if I can't heat safely with mat inside, I'm hoping the fact that the mats higher wattage might mean it has a better chance of heating from the outside too, so will keep trying with this test tank until I either get it right or have nothing else left to try!

[muddydragon]

wow that's a lot of tanks! (10+?) (not that i don't have around that many at the moment with all the babies )

well my partner has learnt to accept them you need to get yours better trained

well let us know how the experiment goes!
best of luck!

[Evil Angel]

I think I'll need 15 tanks, probably between 2ft and 4ft long.. And theres no way I could fit all those in, so tubs are defo better for me as I can stack them!

My partner's mother is very house-proud and has an extreme case of OCD, so he came from a house that didn't so much as have a speck of dirt anywhere! And he's now having to put up with things like guinea pigs, ferrets, 70 rats, mice, hamsters, stick insects, slugs, snails, aquatic snails and frogs, and of worst of all, smelly little kiddies haha, so if the only condition is that I keep them all clean and looking as tidy as I can just in case his mum pops over then I think I've got off lightly lol!

Will defo be posting pics and letting everyone know how I got on with it!
Thanks!