Snail can't eat - help!

[cat21]

I have an 8 year old giant African land snail, Carl, and I've just noticed something is wrong with him - I think he might have gut extrusion! I've just been watching him try to eat and he doesn't seem to be able to, I've uploaded a video clip here: www.dropbox.com/s/dxssiaiy3kb9lgj/File%2022-02-2016%2C%2000%2030%2010.mov?dl=0

I'm really worried and I don't know what to do. My other snail died of gut extrusion a year ago but his body had retracted deeply into his shell before that and he was obviously ill, and the gut extrusion was huge. I followed advice and punctured and drained it to make him more comfortable and he just retracted further into his shell and died within a couple days. But Carl hasn't been showing any other signs of illness - he hasn't retracted at all and he's still very active! He just doesn't seem to be able to eat and I don't know if there's anything I can do or if I'm better just to leave him be.

[cat21]

Here's a photo too

[etana]

Well first I can assure you that that's not gut extrusion. Looks like there is a problem with his mouth though.

How about you make him a smoothie and see if he is able to eat by just sucking food? Some snails with sore mouths get better with a liquid/smoothie diet, some remain on it, but he'll get his nutrients. I would suppose that calcium has to be in a form that he won't need to rasp, too. Don't mix it in with his smoothies though.

Best of luck and keep us updated!

[cat21]

That's good news, thanks for letting me know! I'll try making him a smoothie and see if he can manage that.

[cat21]

I tried giving him some puréed banana with a splash of water mixed in, and as soon as I put it next to him he started sucking it up hungrily! Thanks for the advice!

[etana]

That's really great to hear! You're welcome.

[cat21]

I'll need to switch to a different source of calcium because I only have cuttlefish bone at the moment - do you have any recommendations? I've been looking into liquid calcium but I can only seem to find it with other minerals added (e.g. magnesium) and I'm not sure if that would be alright to feed him?

[HazelSnail]

You could probably grind up some cuttlebone into a powder, and mix it in or sprinkle it on top of his food

[etana]

I would try to grind the cuttlebone as Hazel said, though I'd offer a little pile of it on a separate little dish and see if he's interested and able to have it.

Adding it straight to his food is problematic, too much calcium can cause internal stones that lead to death.

Limestone flour can be made into a watery serving I think... Umm. I wonder if morningcoffee knows about the liquid calcium as I honestly don't?

I could also try to tag Selena as she has had snails with sore mouths on smoothie diets before, and it only now occurred to me that we didn't discuss how they got their calcium.

[cat21]

I'll give the ground cuttlefish bone a try, thanks!

[cat21]

Another thing that's been worrying me are these little lumps he's developed all over his skin - does anyone know what could have caused that?

[morningcoffee]

Feb 24, 2016 23:06:54 GMT cat21 said:

Another thing that's been worrying me are these little lumps he's developed all over his skin - does anyone know what could have caused that?

The picture is tiny so it's very hard to see. What substrate do you keep him on? Make sure there is no fertiliser or anything added to it.

[etana]

Feb 25, 2016 11:47:48 GMT morningcoffee said:

Feb 24, 2016 23:06:54 GMT cat21 said:

Another thing that's been worrying me are these little lumps he's developed all over his skin - does anyone know what could have caused that?

The picture is tiny so it's very hard to see. What substrate do you keep him on? Make sure there is no fertiliser or anything added to it.

Actually if you click on it and download from the page that opens up, it's not that small. However I don't know what the lumps are. 

Morningcoffee, do you know whether liquid calcium supplements can be used for snails who can't rasp due to a mouth problem, but are able and willing to drink?

[morningcoffee]

Feb 25, 2016 12:44:53 GMT etana said:

Actually if you click on it and download from the page that opens up, it's not that small. However I don't know what the lumps are. 

Morningcoffee, do you know whether liquid calcium supplements can be used for snails who can't rasp due to a mouth problem, but are able and willing to drink?

Yep, a reptile calcium supplement like Exo Terra Calcium Liquid diluted correctly should be safe, however I wouldn't give it too regularly due to the potential risk of overdosing and causing internal problems.
I would not use a calcium supplement intended for humans or birds.

[cat21]

Feb 25, 2016 11:47:48 GMT morningcoffee said:

Feb 24, 2016 23:06:54 GMT cat21 said:

Another thing that's been worrying me are these little lumps he's developed all over his skin - does anyone know what could have caused that?

The picture is tiny so it's very hard to see. What substrate do you keep him on? Make sure there is no fertiliser or anything added to it.

I use coir - I buy it in blocks from a pet shop so I don't think it should have fertiliser or anything added to it. I have an infestation of springtails and nematodes in the tank (no matter how many times I clean it out I can't seem to get rid of them!) but it's never seemed like they were bothering him.

He's been eating the ground cuttlefish bone so I think I'll just stick with that for now. Is there a risk of overdosing with that too? I've been putting it in a separate dish to his food but he seems to have been eating quite a lot of it, so would I be better not to give it to him every day? His mouth seems to be looking a lot more normal now

[crockatt]

I think he will know exactly how much he needs and will stop eating it when he has had enough, as for spring tails, they eat waste food etc in the soil and I don't think will be an issue, spring tails don't like dry conditions, maybe your substrate is over wet and drying it a little would get rid of some of them.

[etana]

Crockatt is right, he won't overdose on the ground cuttlebone. That is really great that he is able to have it. I'm very glad that his mouth is healing, too! Keep us posted!

[cat21]

It looks like he definitely has gut extrusion now! It's hard to see the size in the photos but it's several centimetres long. Is there anything I can do for him or is he dying?

This happened to my other snail just before he died, but he'd been retracting deeply into his shell so I knew he was ill. But apart from the problem with his mouth Carl had seemed fine - he's been active and managing to suck up food. I gave the tank a full clean yesterday (I have to do it every few months because the number of springtails and nematodes keeps getting completely out of control), so I'm worried that could have caused it and it's my fault!

[cat21]

I tried 5 times to puncture and drain it but there's still a big bubble left which I can't get rid of. So I think I'm just going to leave him in peace now - it looks like he might be starting to retract away into his shell the way my other snail died so hopefully he won't have to suffer for too much longer

[etana]

Awwwwww. If you keep several months between full cleans (and especially if you are able to keep a part of the old soil) then it's not your fault. He's a very old snail who's had trouble for a long time and he wouldn't have come this far without you making all his pureed meals.

That's good that you tried the puncturing, if nothing else it's less uncomfortable for him now. Probably a lot less, really, as pressure like that can't feel good. I guess it's time to say farewell though.

[cat21]

Carl passed away a few days ago - I waited a couple of days to be certain he was gone and I buried him yesterday I'll really miss him but at least he lived a long life and doesn't have to suffer any longer.

[etana]

I'm sorry for your loss, but you took such good care of him.

[cat21]

Thanks etana