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Post by copigeon on Sept 1, 2011 12:20:22 GMT
Im looking for any of the following:
Achatina iredalei,
Achatina fulica hameilli (genuine hamillei not " yellow snails with stripes")
Pleurodonte sp. (not isabella)
Helix pomatia or lucorum
Please contact me via the forum or at contact@bristolinverts.co.uk if you can supply any of the above.
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Post by luciebella on Sept 1, 2011 13:16:06 GMT
Hi, I've got 12 Iredalei at the moment, 5 are older with 3/5cm shells and 7 are smaller, 1cm or less shells. Not decided how many I want to part with yet but I'll be in touch either tonight or tomorrow and let you know :-)
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Post by copigeon on Sept 1, 2011 14:03:44 GMT
That would be great, luciebella, thankyou.
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Post by haworthii on Sept 7, 2011 12:56:30 GMT
I've in this moment about 200-400 eggs about the true Achatina fulica var, hamillei!
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strangemouse
Archachatina marginata
Captive bred pet snails and other invertebrates at www.mostlymolluscs.co.uk
Posts: 20
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Post by strangemouse on Sept 8, 2011 22:12:27 GMT
I'm confused. What is meant by 'true' Achatina fulica hamillei? My understanding from an admittedly old reference (abstract below) is that hamillei is the streaked form of Achatina fulica and rodatzi the unstreaked form. Please share any more recent taxonomy, I am concerned about selling misnamed snails! www.conchsoc.org/resources/show-abstract-31.php?id=406Thanks Victoria |
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latebloomer
Achatina immaculata
The Snail Botherer
Posts: 251
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Post by latebloomer on Sept 9, 2011 8:24:35 GMT
Are there any photos of the variants to compare anywhere? There seems to be enough variety in the one species to collect!
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Post by wolf on Sept 9, 2011 8:24:56 GMT
Hi Victoria, thanks for your link. A. fulica fulica and A. fulica hamillei surely both are streaked. As far as I know, “ hamillei” was described as a true species by E. Smith in 1881 (Proc. Zool. Soc. 1881, p. 282, pl.32, Fig. 10), perhaps even earlier by Petit in the year 1858. In those days it was therefore called “ Achatina hamillei”, differing from Achatina fulica mainly in a smaller hight to width – ratio (kind of “bulbous” shell, whereas A. fulica being more slender). Furthermore, in A. hamillei the streaks on the last whorl tend to fuse (see Martens, E. von (1897): Beschalte Weichthiere Deutsch-Ost-Afrikas – Dietrich Reimer (Ernst Vohsen), Berlin.), so that the ultimate whorl (!) becomes very dark. In later years, hamillei became a subspecies of A. fulica. So we ended up in “ Achatina fulica ssp. hamillei” = “ Achatina fulica hamillei”. In 1852, “ Achatina rodatzi“ was described (as a true species, as usual.......) in Dunker, W. (1852): Diagnoses molluscorum novorum -- Zeitschrift für Malakozoologie 9: 125-128, 189-191, Cassel. Later investigations suggested that “ rodatzi” is only a “forma” (= f.) of A. fulica hamillei (see f.e. Allen, J.A. (1983): The inheritance of a shell colour polymorphism in Achatina fulica Bowdich from east Africa -- Journal of Conchology 31: 185-189, London). So the correct name of a “ rodatzi” belonging to the subspecies hamillei should be Achatina fulica hamillei f. rodatzi. On the other hand, since 1960 on an official level there are no smaller taxonomic units in zoology than subspecies (“var.” has vanished, it is an undefined unit, see ICZN = International Commission for Zoological Nomenclature). "forma" (= f.) is allowed, but without taxonomic (!) relevance. Of course, animal holders and breeders can do anything they want (and call their variations “f. Che Guevara”, for example). Whether all rodatzi belong to the subspecies hamillei any more is a different question. Kind regards  : wolf |
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Post by haworthii on Sept 9, 2011 12:19:15 GMT
Hi Wolf!
wonderfull and exaustive informations!!! i thank you !!! I've a question.... Do all the hamillei or all the rodatzii it's from a single locality data or differents? I've for the rodatzii of differents data: one from Madagascar and another form Tanzania .... same for the hamillei one from Madagascar and another an albino form from Tanzania..... Do you know it? Do it's correct?
I thank you a lot
Giuseppe
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Post by wolf on Sept 9, 2011 16:38:26 GMT
Hi Giuseppe, Dunker (1852, p. 127-128) based his description on a specimen from the island Zanzibar. By the way, he called it “ rodatzi” (only one “i”), and - as far as I know - the name given by the author and used in the original description has to be conserved. John A. Allen got immature snails from coastal Tanzania: (streaked) hamillei and rodatzi from the grounds of Tambaza School in Dar es Salaam and from “outside the Cathedral, Zanzibar”. Streaked “ hamillei” were also found at Kinondoni, University Campus, Ubungo, Wazo Hill and Kunduchi. Allen points out that the periostracum was yellow in rodatzi and yellow-brown in hamillei. Dissection of 20 adult snails did not show any consistent anatomical differences between streaked and unstreaked ( rodatzi) specimens. Sorry, that´s all I know…..  . I have no informations about rodatzi populations on Madagascar. Sorry, too, for smashing this thread up..... . Perhaps this discussion can be altered to a thread of its own?? Kind regards: wolf |
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strangemouse
Archachatina marginata
Captive bred pet snails and other invertebrates at www.mostlymolluscs.co.uk
Posts: 20
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Post by strangemouse on Sept 15, 2011 22:58:40 GMT
Thank you Wolf for the information. I have not been able to track down the original descriptions myself being old publications and having enough research to do for my university dissertation!
Sorry for the thread clutter Em!
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Post by haworthii on Sept 26, 2011 11:33:53 GMT
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Post by wolf on Sept 26, 2011 16:55:06 GMT
Hi, Giuseppe! Thanks a lot....... . Of course we all are free to name a snail " Achatina fulica var. hamillei", but in an official sense it´s kind of problematic, because " hamillei" is more a subspecies than a "var.", and "var." is an invalid unit in zoology. All of your specimens seem to be (!) rather slender, while " hamillei" should be bulbous. The larger two specimens on the right side fit the description of " hamillei" well, concerning the fusing of the bands on the last whorl. The three specimens on the left side don´t show this feature, but perhaps the bands will fuse when the animals are adult. I think it´s possible that over the last years some " fulica fulica" have mixed up with " fulica hamillei" in captivity, so intermediate forms might be found. Kind regards: wolf |
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Post by haworthii on Sept 27, 2011 14:54:19 GMT
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: wolf
. I have no informations about rodatzi populations on Madagascar.