Justin and the extent of his illness

[KathyM]

I know I said I wouldn't update any more, but this is really important. I'm struggling to weigh up his quality of life.

Here are some pics of Justin as he is today. Up until today he has been retracted past the point of his body being visible (so past the "bend" so to speak). I bathed them all this morning and now wish I hadn't as he came out (might sound like good news to you but he's done this before and he's not recovering - it's like it's the bath alone that keeps him alive).

I have to stress that tonight was going to be his last night - Baz and I had talked it through so it was extremely upsetting to come home and see him out (only because he'd had a bath) when he's in no fit state to continue. It's like he won't let me help him, and won't help himself.


You can see just how horrendously thin he is here.


He is so retracted even when "out" that his shell digs into him when he tries.


You can see how retracted he is even when out. When he went back in (soon after this small outing) he retracted past the curve in his shell so you can't see him at all in there.

I have no doubt that he'd have slipped away today or tomorrow if I hadn't bathed him. This is how cruel it is for me to carry on, whatever anyone thinks this can't be humane.

But it's also hard for me to squish him now when he's been out - I keep hoping that he'll die on his own and save me that final job, one I don't think I can do (hence me asking the other half).

[KathyM]

Sorry I should add that this is the first time in 3 weeks that he has been out properly. He hasn't pooed in a long while so can't be eating very well.

[felix93]

Kathy I am sorry to see how Justin is, he is very skinny. I know I cannot say much to make you feel better because from what I read the posts in the past you have tried very hard.

I am just wondering since you mentioned that you could not squish him since he came out after the bath. You know when he retracted back very inwards again, is that right to just put him in the freezer, may be he might not feel that much since he is pretty weak? Sometimes I wish they can just slip away fast, then the weight is also lifted. But it might not be the case all the time.

I hope you do not take this as an offence because I just want to see if I can suggest you anything. Sorry if I have said anything wrong.

[KathyM]

Thanks felix - no I'm not offended at all, your post is very much appreciated. I really don't know what to do, I don't want to leave him suffering but I don't want him to have suffering at my hands either. I think I'll sleep on it and think some more. I really am grateful for your message.

[Val]

Kathy, I am so sorry that Justin is no better, it is so very hard to try and make decisions about life and death. I can only say what I would do in your position, I would tuck him into a corner of the tank, into a bed of moss and there I would leave him. The choice is then taken away, if he is too weak to recover he will pass away. I really feel for you, I know how hard this can be.

Val

[LisaLQ]

Have you tried upping the heat and humidity? ;D

[KathyM]

Thanks Val - that's kindof what I've been doing for the last couple of weeks, but today I couldn't see him in the shell at all and I had to know if he was dead, so stupidly bathed him.

Lisa - [sarcasm] wow thanks for that, I hadn't even thought of it. Cheers for letting me in on your secret ;D [/ sarcasm]

[section8angel]

Oh Kathy I'm sorry Poor Justin.

I can't say what I'd do if I were you as I really have no idea. Saying goodluck doesn't sound right, but I hope you know what I mean

[KathyM]

I know what you mean Sian, and thank you for your post.

This morning Justin hadn't moved (he'd obviously been knocked over by one of the others as he was aperture up). He's back to being fully retracted, can only see where he is through his thin shell

[Deleted]

awww I'm sorry Lisa. I know how upsetting it is when this happens he's probably past the point of no return now. the worst part of this problem is they die so slowly

[sezzy5889]

Yeah yeah Lisa, very funny

[LisaLQ]

Thanks for the message Mike, but it's Kathy's snail

Glad you enjoyed the joke Sarah

[Moracai]

Any news today on poor Justin?

[LisaLQ]

I think Kathy'll be round in the morning, I'll get her to pop on and update you - she doesn't have a computer at home any more, so uses mine

[KathyM]

No news, he hasn't been out since just after those pics were taken.

[Moracai]

Oh dear, poor little thing.
I hope he somehow manages to recover.

[KathyM]

Still not out, so I doubt it very much. I think he would've passed away a long time ago if I hadn't messed with him and bathed him so much. Without constant support he can't make it, and I have to realise that me forcing him to stay alive is unfair. My OH and I have discussed things and we both feel that if he hasn't come out on his own accord, it's time to prepare to help him die.

[section8angel]

My thoughts are with you Kathy.

[KathyM]

Thanks Sian *hug*. Think it's time I toughened up, I've been avoiding this moment like the plague.

[section8angel]

*Hugs* I don't blame you You're already tougher than me, I doubt I'd even be able to talk about doing it.

[Deleted]

lisalq said:

Thanks for the message Mike, but it's Kathy's snail

Glad you enjoyed the joke Sarah

oh sorry i get confused ;D

[anjieburdett]

Sorry to hear that Kathy - you're being very brave. I know how hard it is to make these decisions No one likes playing god but sometimes its for the best.

Have you decided on what you are going to do exactly....that would be the hardest part for me - i couldn't do it myself and i just don't know what i would do!!

Anyway, my thoughts are with you as are everyone elses no doubt.

Anjie,x.

[KathyM]

Thanks Anjie - no we haven't decided how we're actually going to do it. I think that's why it's taken us this long to help him pass over. I don't want his last moments to be suffering, but then he can't be comfortable the way he is If I knew a way where he wouldn't feel any discomfort/pain, I'd feel a lot better about helping him. I just don't want to hurt him.

[Moracai]

How about the local vet? Could they help you out?
You have made a very tough decision, one that I am not sure if I could make, and I am sure Justin appreciates everything you have done for him.
My thoughts are with you, and with Justin.