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Post by ceiron on Jan 3, 2006 18:21:54 GMT
lisa didnt mean to say that ya havent tried, was just backign up paul.
sowy.
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LisaLQ
Archachatina papyracea
Old friend (emphasis on the "old")
Posts: 2,995
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Post by LisaLQ on Jan 3, 2006 18:34:09 GMT
No worries Ceiron, I've been a touchy moody old cow on this thread and apologise to all. They dont rasp me much, they might for a second as their put their head down, but usually they just kinda twirl round a bit and leave a load of slime on my hand - so they're not stuck to me like they normally would be. Eg. if I tipped my hand up, they'd slide off.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jan 3, 2006 18:49:24 GMT
No worries Ceiron, I've been a touchy moody old cow on this thread and apologise to all. you don't have to apologize lisa it just shows what a caring owner you are that you're so concerned. Personally I think it has to be something with the species, we've been keeping other snails in the same tank that have been growing fine. Paul, did u hatch a dimidiata batch from eggs? did they all grow ok? I mean most of our problems are with snails around 3-5cm, and thats usually the size they're posted to other people.
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Post by Paul on Jan 3, 2006 22:54:07 GMT
Yeah, I hatched a clutch of 90 eggs. They all hatched and from what I have heard so far, most seem to be doing well.
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Beth
Achatina achatina
Posts: 40
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Post by Beth on Jan 4, 2006 14:58:47 GMT
I thought I'd better add my bit here as I have been mentioned and may help add a little light to the research on dimidiata keeping. I bought two adult dimis in March 2005 at the same time as Paul and from the same source. (adults on day we had them) Mine laid a batch of eggs mid June about 6 weeks after Paul's did. I had 138 babies (a surprise batch that arrived while I was ill or I'd have never let so many hatch!). (babies a few days old) Sarah had 10 when they were very small and over the next few weeks I sold several more (I could look back in my mail and contact these people if necessary). In August when they were about 6 weeks old I sent a quantity of these babies to Virginia Cheeseman. Now please don't come down on me here as I believe her to be a very caring dealer and I needed to home the snails quickly at the time due to other commitments and lack of time to advertise and post them out etc. I had already dealt with her and was happy (and still am happy) for her to have them for selling on. I knew her p&p was high and hoped that if people paid those prices the snails had a chance of getting better homes. The snails all left me in good health as far as I could tell, with new shell growth and healthy appetites and measuring between 1 and 2.5cm (see picture). I think size variation in a batch is normal (please correct me if I'm wrong). (August 2005) I kept 14 babies several more weeks then in October I offered 9 on petsnails and cybersnail . (October 2005) These snails had slowed down in growth and had rough areas to their shells with a small area of new growth (I thought this normal as the parents have rough areas of growth and all were active and eating, plus my fulica babies growth had slowed and it was Autumn, so all seemed to make sense) All went to various places (again I could email people and ask how they are if it would help, I have only had good reports back to date). I believe I could trace and find out the condition of about 40ish snails from this batch. I have no idea if Virginia has had any problems or if snails bought from anyone on the board from her came from me originally. I know she has had dimis from other sources in the past . I believe of the 10 I sent Sarah she still has 3, one she lost in an accident and the rest she re-homed. One of Sarah's didn't grow after reaching 1cm the rest I believe are doing well, but are slow growing and had a problem with mites for a short time. Their growth has improved by upping their heat and moisture recently (correct me if I'm wrong Sarah ). Of the 5 I still have, 1 stopped growing at 1cm and the rest started to slow down in growth at about 3-4cm (they are currently between 3.5cm-4.7cm which would seem about right compared to Paul's baby which is about 6 weeks older...), I found that an increase in temperature and moisture has helped with this, but they are still growing very slowly, not anywhere near the speed of fulicas! They all seem active most nights and eat well, even the tiny one They love to burrow though and get really dirty! They will happily hog the heat mat and just poke their heads out to eat if given the choice. They are definitely night time and early morning snails. Their shells have rough areas of growth but so do the adults. Here's a resent picture. (Jan 2006) I can only go on my experiences which isn't much as I haven't had these snails through a Winter yet, but they do seem different in there needs to fulica in that they like a warmer, wetter tank and seem to like periods of 'rest'. The parents really had me worried a few weeks back as they kept sealing and burying themselves everyday and stopped eating. I'd wake them daily, they would take a couple of mouthfuls of food then seal back up under the compost. After days of this I gave up trying to change things as nothing seemed to help and I left them (other than weekly weighing ) To my surprise after 3 weeks 'sleeping' and only a tiny weight loss they 'woke up' on the same night and have been really active every night since and seem much happier (if you know what I mean ) So as you see with-in my batch, there have been small snails......but what is normal with-in a batch of 138 snails? Would all grow normally in the wild (I doubt they would) or could my snails be in-breed coursing a growth problem? So is their slow growth normal..... who knows...but this is a start to us finding out. (Jan 2006) I'm really sorry to hear about the problems some of you are having with your dimis. I have two fulica with 'retracting problems' at the moment and I know how helpless you can feel and how hard it is when you have kids involved. I hope my information helps in some way to getting to the source. I'm really sorry if any snails from my batch have coursed heart ache for anyone. I would never knowingly have sold anyone 'ill' snails Please don't all be put off dimis, they can be such beautiful friendly creatures. Well done if you read all that!!!! I don't get a lot of time to post here, but I'm a keen snail lover and do pop in and out to see how you and all your snail friends are. ;D Take care all, Beth
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Kevin
Archachatina dimidiata
Posts: 2,227
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Post by Kevin on Jan 4, 2006 15:08:50 GMT
Beth, the dimidiata I got from you last year are doing well, they are eating well, they havent grown much, but for they're size, have nice shells.
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Post by sezzy5889 on Jan 4, 2006 15:14:23 GMT
yes you are absolubtly right Beth, since i raised the yemperature in my tank i haven't seen my dimi's asleep as yet and are starting to grow again :-)
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KathyM
Achatina tincta
Posts: 709
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Post by KathyM on Jan 4, 2006 15:19:05 GMT
Beth, in all likelihood, Justin (and Lisa's two) are probably your babies, as they came from VC in September. I really appreciate your post and I dont blame anyone for what's happened. However, we have tried everything with heat and moisture and it's not worked, I managed to get him out for a short while last night, but he kept wanting to curl back into his shell. He's now fully retracted again but I did manage to give him a green tea bath. When I put him on the food (first lettuce, then I tried porridge), he did the blistery thing and recoiled. He wont come out today. He's not in hibernation/aestivation. Last night I was shocked at how thin he is. This is dragging out too much for him (and us) and I'm beginning to wonder whether it's time to have a word with my vet about the kindest form of euthanasia.
Lisa's aren't too well either, they've lost weight and haven't eaten for a while.
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Post by sezzy5889 on Jan 4, 2006 15:25:01 GMT
that started to happen to mine, i had them in a small plastic tank and had them on a heat mat, but apparently the heat mat just wasn't enough, so now they are in a large glass tank on capillary matting and moss with a plastic lid and little ventilation with a heat mat and heat lamp so that when i open the tank or put my hand in i get really warm air come out, they are kept at the same temperature and after a week of being in there they began to get new shell growth not perfect shell growth but shell growth, half a cm of it to be precise, which is pretty good to me, this is the first time they have grown and stayed up more than 24 hours in 4 months, so i'm pretty sure it's this change thats done it.
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LisaLQ
Archachatina papyracea
Old friend (emphasis on the "old")
Posts: 2,995
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Post by LisaLQ on Jan 4, 2006 15:29:08 GMT
Ive had mine with heat mat, and pushed up against a radiator believe it or not (worked for the margies), and initially they came out, but they've since gone back into lazy mode, and not eaten still. They do come out, but they never eat. I put them on food, they wander off to the moss or "roof". I put them on cuttlefish, they do the same. I up the heat, they come out for a wander, then go back to "normal". I think we must just have ended up with the runts, that's all I can think of - because my house is very warm, and their tank is warm. But even runts must have some sort of appetite?
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Post by sezzy5889 on Jan 4, 2006 15:30:45 GMT
are you using capillary matting?
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LisaLQ
Archachatina papyracea
Old friend (emphasis on the "old")
Posts: 2,995
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Post by LisaLQ on Jan 4, 2006 15:33:02 GMT
Yes. And we've tried various composts, and sphagnum moss. I wouldn't have the moss in there now if they were in that tank alone - but I dont want to take away the other snails burying grounds. The reason they're in with them is because they seem ever so slightly more active when they have company. On their own, they dont come out at all.
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Post by sezzy5889 on Jan 4, 2006 16:14:24 GMT
mine are in with about 15 more babies
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Post by sophie on Jan 4, 2006 16:16:34 GMT
ohhhhhhhh i SO want an adult dimi with full colour my baby died a while a go they have such beautiful shells.
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Post by section8angel on Jan 4, 2006 16:32:55 GMT
perhaps, they dont like being sent out and going to different places. maybe theyre so sensetive that going to a new environment scares them or something? I hadn't thought to mention this till I re-read this thread and saw what you said Mike. My dimis weren't posted. They were taken from their tank, put into a small tub with some of their substrate and food and brought straight to me the same day (which was also a warm day). They then went straight in with my baby fulica, with their food and some of their substrate. They didn't even travel that far either, so it wasn't a long journey. Everyone who has "ill" dimis, were they posted to you? Mike has said his were and that they were fine until they were sent to him. I assume they all were as they're in many different places, but I don't know where everyone lives and who they live near, hence me asking lol. I know it's probably a long shot, but obviously it could be a factor as it has been mentioned before? Just a quick thing also about when I saw the blistering on mine. I hadn't touched their skin. All I touched was their shell, so does that take the "something on my skin reacting" idea away from mine?
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LisaLQ
Archachatina papyracea
Old friend (emphasis on the "old")
Posts: 2,995
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Post by LisaLQ on Jan 4, 2006 18:40:12 GMT
Yeah Sian, like I said (I think - knowing me I probably didn't *lol*), Gary and Sally have blistered up when just on the tank wall - without touching me. Maybe stress, water difference, being posted (ours were)?
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Post by section8angel on Jan 4, 2006 19:34:59 GMT
Mine did it before I even sprayed them. So with mine I think I can rule out water and myself lol. Stress seems to be the most likely?
Was it you that said your others did it too once before? I know a few other people said they'd noticed it with their other snails I just can't remember who lol.
Just wondering if those people can remember if the other snails might have been stressed. If they weren't eating etc or hadn't eaten as normal for a period of time.
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LisaLQ
Archachatina papyracea
Old friend (emphasis on the "old")
Posts: 2,995
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Post by LisaLQ on Jan 4, 2006 19:53:56 GMT
Well Cooper has definitely done it, and that b*gger never stops eating! ;D
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Post by Paul on Jan 5, 2006 6:00:17 GMT
Ive had mine with heat mat, and pushed up against a radiator believe it or not (worked for the margies), and initially they came out, but they've since gone back into lazy mode, and not eaten still. They do come out, but they never eat. I put them on food, they wander off to the moss or "roof". I put them on cuttlefish, they do the same. I up the heat, they come out for a wander, then go back to "normal". I think we must just have ended up with the runts, that's all I can think of - because my house is very warm, and their tank is warm. But even runts must have some sort of appetite? After reading the further comments, I think in your case it is that retraction illness some of us have experienced. The symptoms really do sound the same. I'm not sure how it is passed around and not every snail gets it. But it sure sounds like it to me, and that's why I'd rule out runts in this case.
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LisaLQ
Archachatina papyracea
Old friend (emphasis on the "old")
Posts: 2,995
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Post by LisaLQ on Jan 5, 2006 8:07:41 GMT
Thanks Paul, it's kind of what I expected, considering Kathy's fella is at death's door Have you ever known snails to get over it?
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Post by Paul on Jan 5, 2006 9:16:47 GMT
Yeah, I have had 2 recover but about 7 snails die, including a fully grown one. It seems to have stopped now but it was slow to move through the tanks. I tried everything I could think of, I obsessed about it and nothing I did worked that I know of. I think they just beat it or they don't. It is still worth trying though. I think there have been other recoveries but I can't remember for certain if these problems were the same or caused by something else with similar symptoms. From what I can guess at, I think if there is an incubation time it is up to 8 weeks, so you think the problem is over and then another one gets ill. Of course, if it is viral then it could be indefinite before it flares up. But as it now seems to have stopped I think it is very much like a cold or the flu for us, only pretty fatal.
I've never seen an Archachatina with the problem even though they have been in contact. So far, I've seen fulica, panthera and immaculata affected. The reticulata, "stuhlmanni", achatina and iredalei have not been affected. I still worry it will start again but so far things have been better for a good while now.
But there is still a small hope they will pull through and there is no proof that it is the same illness.
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Post by sezzy5889 on Jan 5, 2006 10:02:23 GMT
but you have to think now those snails that got through it, now have some immunity to it and will be stronger if it happens to come back
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KathyM
Achatina tincta
Posts: 709
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Post by KathyM on Jan 6, 2006 15:15:34 GMT
Another update on Justin. His air hole (sorry don't know the scientific term) is still opening and closing but he won't come out at all now and has retracted further. Can anyone give me some advice on what to do next? He's retracted so far now it's hard to see him recovering and I don't want him to suffer.
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Post by sezzy5889 on Jan 6, 2006 15:34:55 GMT
heat the tank more, heay it as much as you can, it can't make it any worse can it
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LisaLQ
Archachatina papyracea
Old friend (emphasis on the "old")
Posts: 2,995
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Post by LisaLQ on Jan 6, 2006 19:04:19 GMT
It could make the others suffer though. Assuming there are others in the tank (I dunno as haven't been round for yonks).
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